OGC's Shield-heavy Ships

OGCroflAZN

I tried using large cannons, but to have them be behind the inner layer of shielding, there is no room for ammo storage behind it. Ammo storage could be put on the sides, but then there would be a gap in the outer shielding. The only other option is to have ammo carried from some distance away.

This ship really doesn't have much firepower anyway, so I chose to rather have the regular cannons which I could put more of, put ammo behind, which also have better fire rate and projectile speed, whose range is closer to the electrobolts anyways which I often use together.

Taorec

The cube looks very nice OGC, the Blugeon needs weapons though imo. If you replace all the ammo storage with factories you save the transport way. I tried your designs out a bit and the shields deplete really fast. I found that if you place a power plant behind two shield generators it charges ridiculiously fast, though there should be armor two places in front of the shield. (see example, try it out against the Blugeon)

Nope

MrLeftHand

Taorec yes I agree, it has many shields but those are useless when going up against a ship that spans teslas and it definitl y lacks firepower

OGCroflAZN

Taorec

The overlapping shielding of your design was very very formidable. I didn't think I would be able to do anything, but I tried the same thing I did with @Rhyme 's design.

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The Electrobolts really worried me, but I made sure to stay at cannon range. The first thing I went for was your rear Electrobolts. After that, I went after the rear Shield Generators and engines. Once those engines were gone, your ship couldn't rotate fast enough to keep me from the rear.

4 cannons give enough firepower to overcome shielding and slowly grind down both of your formidable warships, as well as the vanilla ships, so why would I add more weapons which would necessitates weakening the defenses? I prefer the large capacity of Energy Storage over Reactors, which allow the crew to keep my inner shield up very well. I have more than enough crew moving energy from my Reactors to my Energy storage via moving walkways.

Atarlost

MrLeftHand That's why I suggest large cannons. If you have enough reverse engines compared to your mass and are focused on long range weapons you never need to get into electrobolt range. Having more widely spaced shield pairs to fit the larger guns is offset by not having to get shot at by electrobolts, laser blasters, or standard cannons.

OGCroflAZN

MrLeftHand

Any ship can be beaten by a ship stacked with Electrobolts, Cannons, and engines. I never said that my ships were the best, but they are good for anything in Vanilla, and used properly can take no damage.

Rhyme

OGCroflAZN BountyBrainHard does focus all their fire on one area.

Yes, but it doesn't always completely destroy its target. It will often start damaging one of your cannons, but will switch targets before it actually dies, switching to a different area with full shields instead of completely focusing down your individual weapons.

Also, the AI will target electro bolts and cannons almost equally. Your cannons are obviously a bigger threat to my ship than your electro bolts, but the AI won't always target them 1st.

OGCroflAZN mostly just armor hits from missiles.

Neither of our ships have missiles though... Unless you're fighting an older version of my ship

OGCroflAZN You really couldn't have played much differently than the AI did

I could have reversed while turning, and those combined is faster than your ship can move forward.
Also, the AI has a weird habit with broadside ships turning away from the target. I have my ship armored on the front and shielded on the sides, so when I want to spin around, I always go past the front. Half the time, the AI will go past the back, exposing my engines (which any person could avoid using common sense)

OGCroflAZN

Rhyme

Neither of our ships have missiles though... Unless you're fighting an older version of my ship

I got mixed up with the Crescent. I just looked at the last screenshot.

As you could see from my screenshots, I was wearing away the front of the ship too when it tried to chase. Once the front reactors were gone, the front would also become a vulnerable target.

I could have reversed while turning, and those combined is faster than your ship can move forward.

If your 17 forward thrusters are too slow to catch my 11 large thrusters and 2 regular going backwards, your 7 rear thrusters aren't enough with your rotating thrusters to outrun my 13 forward thrusters. As I said, if you could compensate to protect your rear, you would rotate the tip of your ship toward my ship, and I would continue to grind it down until I blew your front reactors. I was already doing so except the AI then decided to keep me firmly at its boradside. If you managed to aligned your ship such that I couldn't attack your front or rear, we are stalemated because your ship can't catch mine either.

OGCroflAZN

My ship destroys things slowly i suppose, but I don't really mind. The firepower is enough for me, as I could beat any of the vanilla ships without any issue, and I don't prefer to sacrifice defense to increase offense.

Subby84

Hi OGC, i'm new on the game & i'm actually testing missile destroyer type ships.
Keeping max distance from yours actually got me getting through the defense after a while without taking any damages.
I invite you to try it !
image https://i.imgur.com/DGFUGsT.png

OGCroflAZN

Subby84

This one was very interesting. The sheer amount of Electrobolts and their great positioning was very intimidating. I knew I had to do something very quick, as I couldn't just sit back and eat missiles.

https://puu.sh/wT8OK/a6a666abf8.jpg
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The first thing I wanted to do was race to your back, as your ship seemed to be very unwieldy. I started to race forward and your ship sent a wave of missiles. Some were taken down by my point defense but since I was racing forward, I had a disadvantage in that I had a very high relative speed and the missiles slammed into my ship.

After tanking that, I knew it would be a matter of time before your ship reloaded, so I decided to go straight for your center reactors. My Electrobolts and cannon fire were enough to reach the reactors fairly quickly, and when they blew, they set fires or destroyed the other reactors outright. Most of the center of your ship was gone in only 10 or 15 seconds. At that point, your center was wide open, so I cut your ship in half. Then your engines were gone with the ship split into 2 immobile pieces. I could then stay behind those pieces with the Electrobolts and take them out from the back. As you can see, I took ~25k in damage, with 3 Shield Generators, 1 Electrobolt, and 1 walkway lost.

This is why I keep my Reactors to the back. I think if your forward Reactors were replaced with Energy Storage, I would have no chance at all without adding a few more point defense.

Edit: I tried using your ship against mine. How were you able to destroy it with no damage? I just tried.

https://puu.sh/wTaej/c90c462e25.jpg
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I couldn't outrun it, and it went after the reactors. The AI managed to do better than I did. It looks like the main reasons were that I tried to stay at maximum range with your ship, which allowed my ship to have more time to shoot down the incoming missiles. Also, that I chose to move into Electrobolt range.

Taorec

OGCroflAZN Did you have them both on AI? Or did you mange both per hand? When I left them both on AI Hard your ship was completely destroyed in about ~2 mintues.

Subby84

OGCroflAZN heya, i'm glad that u tested it deeply ! Well if played by an AI my ship will mostly die quickly as it doesn't have a great shield on front and none behind. Also i forgot to precise that i tested a fight against your "spin to win" ship. As you know missiles does have the greater range so when i assaulted your spin to win, thanks to the fact it does have only a few engines, i kept the max possible distance between our ships and the constant missiles flow finally got trough on a first angle after around 5 min of battle, with your ship not even shooting one cannon round. The fact is that i need to work on a better propulsion to handle quicker ships the same way. Within the built-in ships the only one that crushes mine is the cerberus. GG

OGCroflAZN

Taorec

No, mines was controlled. As I said, putting both ships on AI is not a good comparison. What would you have done to keep me from slowly grinding the rear? Your ship is slower in translation and rotation compared to @Rhyme 's. At best, we are stalemated.

Taorec

OGCroflAZN Putting both on ships on AI is the best comparison we have until we get multiplayer. The AI isn't that smart but it does an okay job. Controlling only one ship just lends an unfair advantage as Rhyme mentioned even without noting that your ship was twice as costly.

Feel free to improve your design and post an updated version. Mounting more cannons and armoring your front will do much to increase your ships power.

OGCroflAZN

Taorec

It is not even close to the best comparison. In fact, it is the worst comparison taking into account my ships. The shields are for tanking damage, but the engines are for taking the ships out of combat to recharge when needed. Defense and maneuverability are the core facets of my ship. The AI doesn't utilize those tactics at all.

I understand that part about the unfair advantage, but with a ship like yours and @Rhyme 's broadside ships, what could you do very differently than the AI? Both your ships turn their broadsides right at me. Both of you could possible compensate in a PVP setting to prevent me from damaging your ships, but that only makes us, at best, stalemated.

My ship is not even twice as costly. Yours is over 800k, and mines is not even 1,400k. Would it be fairer to go against two of your ships at the same time? I really wouldn't change much in a pvp setting considering mobility.

If letting ships go on AI is the best comparison, then suicide ships are best.

No, the best ships are the ships which perform best player vs player, against the largest variety of ships that are similar cost.

Taorec

OGCroflAZN No, the best ships are the ships which perform best player vs player.

Exactly, but then you have to manage both to the best of your ability. The AI only turns once a weapon is destroyed not when shields start to deplete. That´s obviously a big flaw as rotating the ship could prevent that.

Try against this small ship and you will notice that the front shields collapse immediatly.

OGCroflAZN

Taorec

How many times do I have to say it? I never said my ship was the best, that it was unbeatable. Is it easy to counter my ship. There is a fairly small vanilla ship in game with just 6 electrobolts which tears through my shields and causes me damage, but not any part destruction. So I do know. Jesus.

OGCroflAZN

Taorec

I beat that ship too.

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My ship is faster, still. First, I tried to destroy the Electrobolts, of which I got 4 of them. Then I targetted the wing tips at extreme range. This destroyed the outer two Cannons and the thruster on one side, increasing my speed advantage even more. Then I went in right for one of the Ammo Factories. The explosion caused a fire, and couple with my own weapons, I destroyed much of the right side as I retreated to allow my shields to recover. The I finished the right side, the last Electrobolts, and then the rest of it.

This and the other is why I shield my corners.

Teg

I've had a lot of luck with the layout of Erasmus. The shields are still tough to crack without compromising on firepower.

image https://i.imgur.com/YzyB5vA.png

OGCroflAZN

Teg

I think you should bring those outer reactors closer in or replace them with energy storage. They are vulnerable being so out. And the way that you spaced them, once one of them goes, all of them do. It was quite shocking and awesome to see though.

https://puu.sh/wTfWc/2761913253.jpg

Edit: Speaking of the vulnerabilities..

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The sides near the front and back of the ship need more shielding or something. The engines and reactors could be destroyed by sustained fire from 4 regular cannons. It's those Shield Generators you have near your FTL drives. You should have a pair of shields at least, instead of that shield by itself.