Building Academy

Focus

Daiaurufu-Garu yea, I straight up removed them and cut the price in half for it to work.

Focus

Hatter Hey Hatter! you might be busy, but I've Improved the ship by cutting the cost in half and still destroying the ship in an AI vs AI battle. Here is the improved ship:

Hatter

YAreyaREdAzE If you have any suggestions about how the thread is run, I'm open to hearing them.

The inside of your ship is highly explosive and the shields have poor regen. The mediums are excessive for a 3 engine room cluster unless it's very boost heavy. Back is somewhat exposed, even with the PD. Otherwise it seems competently done.
Might be better served running the ship off of 3 medium reactors.

Try fighting this on AI vs AI.

Focus It's good that you cut out a whole lot of stuff and decided on a focus for the ship, but you could compact the design more. You have large amounts of empty space that make the ship bigger then it needs to be. Lasers and EB are too squishy without shields. Everything can be run off of the single large reactor, provided walkways are used and everything is moved closer. Too much crew.
I recommend removing the small reactors and adding shields while compacting the design as much as possible.

Fight this on AI vs AI

Admiral-Ackbar

Hatter wow! kool ships!
YAreyaREdAzE can me take that?
Daiaurufu-Garu i will take those ships and thankyu

I_Am_Jarvis

CursedPh4nt0m Erm, no, I can confirm that small reactors would NOT be enough for that, Firestorm had sets running on small reactors with WAY less thrusters and barely kept up at all. They'd need Mediums AT LEAST.

CursedPh4nt0m

I_Am_Jarvis Remember Firestorm is a diag. They need thrusters for at least 2 directions running to move properly, so ofc the reactor strain is way higher. As most of those thrusters will never run simultaneously (you'll have half of them running simultaneously at most while that is the minimal amount to get a diagonal moving), the actual power requirements turn out way lower than expected. I know you can easily run 2 maxed out engine rooms using a single small reactor (using large thrusters or below, that is) and the third one is only for maneuvering (and potential strafing), so a battery storage as buffer should suffice to keep them running as long as you don't overdo it on the maneuvers. Which is quite unlikely for a flakwall, considering the usual play style with those.

I_Am_Jarvis

Got a new one, decided to see what I could do, based off of using only a single Large Reactor for power. As it so happens, quite a lot, actually, if paired with proper power storage. Decided to keep it under 1M, though I skipped the Sensor Arrays this time, buuuuut here's the results. Gave it what I figure is a somewhat interesting paint scheme too for the heck of it.

CursedPh4nt0m

I_Am_Jarvis You could actually half the amount of conveyors without even affecting the supply speed at all, the missile sections would work better with the new launcher modules, PD rarely hit anything during testing, thruster pathing is terrible and your only reactor has just about no protection other than the shield row in the front.

Did some testing using Hatter's Ionic and got some decent results for a challenge, but I wanted something with a railgun to point out the major flaw and my only rail build in that price-class gave odd results. I'll do some digging for a proper rail design, but I can't promise anything.

Hatter

CursedPh4nt0m This work?
Was using Kroom's Forge when I saved it, so it looks like it has no crew.

Also an older, cheaper rail:

I_Am_Jarvis

CursedPh4nt0m Yeah, I figured stuff like rails or ion builds would be a bit of a problem for this particular design, especially since it doesn't use stacked shields. In my opinion, with the way it's built, that's just kinda inevitable. After all, all builds have their hard counters, but I can try seeing what I can do about protecting the reactor more, though that's going to be a bit tricky... Maybe also modify the thruster section a tiny bit so that the bottom reactor path isn't the only way to the thruster section.

I_Am_Jarvis

Yeah, upon testing, rails counter it pretty badly, especially since flak are no good against them. Still, I've changed up the few things I said I'd change up and the cost is now 932,500.

(Edit: Fixed the paint)

CursedPh4nt0m

I_Am_Jarvis This already looks considerably better, but you still didn't fix the conveyors (did a short check, you could safe more than 10k credits by removing the excess ones) and the door spam adds another 10k+ credits you could've used for maybe another missile launcher, better missile defense or whatever. Another thing that stuck is the bad pathing to the outer shields, the uselessness of PD and the excess missile production being enough for another launcher per module.
Also, I don't know how to feel about the huge thrusters, they seem somewhat misplaced on this build.

Hatter

CursedPh4nt0m
Huge thrusters' high ramp up time means that using them for turning is inefficient because they'll only be briefly on. Using larges/standard thrusters is better.
YAreyaREdAzE
Head on it has excessive durability, but the firepower is lackluster. A well supplied shield can hold off two ion beams indefinitely.
It has excessive power. Either expand the design to use the large reactor more, or trim it down so it can comfortably be supplied by a medium. Rear's exposed and the CR is one cannonshot or a couple stray missiles from dying. Also, no fire extinguishers.

I_Am_Jarvis

CursedPh4nt0m
Hatter

In fairness to the pint about the Huge Thrusters, this thing doesn't actually have much problem turning... though that's probably all the more reason to slim some of them down to Large instead... As for the thing about conveyors, I'm assuming you mean that essentially most of them aren't particularly essential to begin with... As for the outer shields, I figure that MIGHT be fine, since the Large Reactor would hold the higher target priority over the corners significantly. I'd also have to do some compacting to get more launchers in there, but I can see what I can do about that...

YAreyaREdAzE

context: flanker. not the best maneuverability, but still

dodo_bear

CursedPh4nt0m Are we still working on this one?

CursedPh4nt0m

dodo_bear Sorry, that one must've slipped outta my notifications... Dunno whether it happens to many other peeps, but I regularly end up with some invisible notifications if too many people reply to or like the same post in the same timeframe. And as my timeframes between activity tend to quickly rise to several days, it's almost a cronic issue.

Hatter I'm aware of the ramp-up, but they're placed rather close to the center, so their main role would be propulsion rather than turning anyway and a design of this size might profit from the higher thrust even when taking the delay into account. The outer ones should get replaced for sure tho, kinda overlooked them for some reason...

PS: That reply for the flanker is almost identical to what I would've written. Would've probably suggested some PD on the sides of the energy storage or thruster armor tho and you've gotta admit fitting the CR somewhere else is kinda difficult. (The wings might be an option, but that prolly increases the risk of missiles headed for the LC to hit it.)

I_Am_Jarvis I'd be considerably happier if you were to just put the missile launchers and factories in your average module (you know, slapping two factories together with the doorless sides facing each other and attaching launchers to that old-style), maybe adding shields to that if you have to (they fit more or less comfortably behind the outer launchers, tho they don't cover the center ones) and replacing the upper/excess launcher with a flak. That way, you might get to fixing up those weird supply paths, have a constant missile supply and some decent missile defense.
Also, there's still two conveyor lines too much leading towards the rear and they should actually fit above the reactor where you currently only have corridor. Next up would be burrying the CRs so they're at least somewhat protected, putting the power storage between the engine rooms in the center so it can actually be useful, maybe removing the connection between the engine rooms on the same side completely to safe some money and improve pathing and overthink your FTL-drive and power storage placement.
Oh, also avoid clustering your FEs as much, half of them will probably blow up together with the missile factories.

Altraxia

Admiral-Ackbar You can take any ship,as long as you give credit

Admiral-Ackbar Because balancing

Admiral-Ackbar

why is huge truster very slow on begin?

I_Am_Jarvis

Alright, new version, slimmed down to 911,500.

Keeping the PD because it's gotta have SOMETHING to cover the sides at least somewhat. I'm well aware that it's not ideal, but it's at least something other than redundant armor, which would actually cost more to use for the same protection while still keeping the design scheme.

YAreyaREdAzE

I_Am_Jarvis the question, can it do well v ions?

I_Am_Jarvis

YAreyaREdAzE Haven't tested it against ion builds, yet, though I'm not too confident about it...